Christ First Forum

[iPosted: Thu Jul 02, 2009 10:32 pm Post subject:

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When the Lord said to Satan--'Whence comest thou?' He replied, 'From going to and fro in the earth and from walking up and down in it. In Job 1:7; 2:2.

Satan then was at liberty 'on the earth,' and had 'access to God,' and was 'not cast out of Heaven' in Job's day, B.C. 2000.

The Book of Revelation' is a prophecy of'Things to Come',and that were all 'future' in John's day.

Satan had not been cast out of heaven up to that time, A.D. 96,and as he has not been cast out since, he must still be at liberty in the heavenlies on the earth.

'We would have come unto you, even I Paul, once and again, but Satan hindered us,' in 1 Thess 2:18.

Even Paul's 'thorn in the flesh' was the 'Messenger of Satan' to buffet him.

As we have seen Satan still has his abode in the 'Heavenlies' and has access to God.

But the time is coming when he shall be cast out of the 'Heavenlies' described in Rev. 12:7-17.

'And there was war in Heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the Dragon, and the Dragon fought and his angels, and prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in Heaven. And the 'Great Dragon' was cast out, that old Serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world; he was cast out into the earth and his angels were cast out with him.

And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, now is come Salvation,and strength, and the kingdom of God, and the power of His Christ; for the Accuser of Our Brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

While Satan has been the 'Accuser of the Brethren' in all ages, the context shows that reference is here made to the Jewish Remnant, who during the first three and one half years of the Tri. Period (for Satan is cast out in the Middle of the Last Week or Tri) pass through great persecution,and died as martyrs referred in Rev. 6:9-11.

As the 'souls of them that were slain for the Word of God in Rev. 12:11.

As they overcame by the 'Blood of the Lamb,' then the Time of their overcoming must be subsequent to the shedding of the Christ's blood on Calvary, that is, Satan, according to this account, could not have been cast out of the 'Heavenlies' prior to the Crucifixion of Christ.'

When Jesus said--'I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven' in Luke 10:18, he was not referring to some past fall of Satan, but it was a prophetic utterance, by way of anticipation , of his future fall, when he shall be cast out of Heaven by Michael the Archangel.

As further evidence as to the 'time' of satan's casting out, Daniel tells us that it will be at the 'Time of Trouble. (The Great Tri.), that is to come upon Daniel's people, the Jews, for it is that time that Michael is to stand up and they shall be delivered in Dan. 12:1.

As still further evidence that the 'casting out of Satan' did not happen 'before' the Fall in Eden, we are told that it 'follows' the birth and catching out of the 'Man Child,' (Christ) in Rev. 12:5.

That the earth shall be full of inhabitants, that is, thickly populated, and that Satan shall be full of wrath, because he knoweth that he has but a 'short time' in which to finish his devilish work in Rev. 12:12
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Jeani, May I ask who wrote this article?

The Doctrine of Satan
I. The Existence of Satan

A. Seven Old Testament books and every New Testament writer refer to Satan.

B. Jesus referred to Satan (Matt.13:39; Luke 10:18; 11:18).

II. The Personality and Names of Satan

A. Personality – He has intellect (2 Cor.11:3), emotions (Rev.12:17) and will (2 Tim.2:26.

B. Names – He is called Satan, the Devil (slanderer), Lucifer (son of the morning), Beelzebub (Lord of the flies – Matt.12:24), and Belial (lawless – 2 Cor.6:15), the evil one (1 John 5:19), the tempter (1 Thess.3:5), the prince of this world (John 12:31), the god of this age (2 Cor.4:4), the prince of the power of the air (Eph.2:2), the accuser of the brethren (Rev.12:10), and angel of light (false light – 2 Cor.11:14), a serpent (Rev.12:9), and a dragon (Rev.12:3).

III. The Nature of Satan

A. He is a created angelic being. He was created as part of the angelic realm (Eph.6:11,12; Ezek.24:18) and was the highest in rank of them all (Ezek.28:12-14).

B. He is an enemy of righteousness. He is a murderer (John 8:44), a liar (John 8:44), and accuser (Rev.12:10) and our adversary (1 Pet.5:8).

C. He is a limited creature. He is limited by God (Job.1:12). He is not God’s equal (1 John 4:4). He is not omniscient, omnipotent or infinite in any way. Believers with God’s help can resist him (James 4:7).

IV. The Fall of Satan

Key Passages – Ezekiel 28; Isaiah 14

A. Ezekiel 28:11-19 is a prophetic lamentation over the “King of Tyre” who is described in language that fits Satan’s fall and not a mere human king. Satan is distinguished form the human ruler of Tyre in 28:2 (“prince/ruler”) and called a “king” in 28:12 (Not even Israel’s rulers were called “King”). Though Tyre had a human “ruler”, Satan was the real “King” behind that wicked kingdom.

B. His attributes – Moral perfection (v.12) Sinless at his creation until his fall (v.15)

C. His appearance – Perfect in beauty (v.12b,13)

1. His privileges – Free access to the garden of Eden (v.12) and to God’s holy mountain (= God’s presence – v.14)

2. His rank – “Cherub” (vs.14,16)

3. His judgment –

a. Cast out of the mountain of God (v.16, cf. Rev12:4)

b. Cast to the ground (v.17)

c. Consumed by fire (v.18, cf. Rev.20:10)

D. Isaiah 14:12-15 also seems to describe Satan’s fall. Satan is manifest here by the king of Babylon. As in Ezekiel 28, Satan is pictured here as the real “king” behind the wicked human kingdom of Babylon.

1. The imagery of a “star” and “falling from heaven” (v.12) suggests a supernatural fulfillment. “Stars” (v.12,13) are symbolic of the angelic realm elsewhere (Job 38:6,7; Rev.12:4).

2. The five “I will’s” of vss. 13 & 14 are literally true of Satan and only metaphorically true of Babylon’s king. This ultimate form of pride (“I will be like the Most High” – v.14) fits the New Testament description of Satan’s fall 1 Tim.3:6.

V. The Activity of Satan

Satan is seeking to oppose God’s plan by promoting evil in every way possible.

A. Indirect Activity – He works indirectly through the world (in which he has great freedom and power – John 12:31; 1 John 5:19) and the flesh (Gal.5:19-21). The world, the flesh and the devil are not three separate enemies of the Christian. Rather Satan works through the evil world system (1 John 2:13-15) to exploit the fleshly nature that still wars within us (Rom.7:18; Gal.5:19-21).


B. Direct Activity – He works directly by deception, temptation, attack and possession.

1. In Christ’s ministry

a. He tempted Christ (Matt.4:1-11).

b. He attempted to thwart Christ’s work (John 8:44; Matt.16:23; Luke 22:31).

c. He possessed Judas to accomplish the betrayal (John 13:27).

2. In unbelievers

a. He blinds their minds to hinder their understanding of the gospel (2 Cor.4:4).

b. When the gospel is heard or understood, he tries to hinder its effect (Luke 8:12).

c. He uses persecution (Rev.2:10) and false religions (Rev.2:13) to hinder the effect of the gospel.

3. In believers

a. He tempts believers (to pride – 1 Chron.21:1-8; to materialism – John 2:15; James 5:1-7; to immorality – 1 Cor.7:5; to lie – Acts 5:3; to discouragement – 1 Pet.5:6-10; to be unforgiving – 2 Cor.2:10,11 etc.).

b. He hinders the ministries of believers (1 Thess.2:18; Rev.2:10).

c. He promotes false teaching among believers (1 John 4:1-4).

d. He promotes anger, bitterness and division (Eph.4:26,27; 2 Cor.2:5-11). Note: See the supplement – “Satanic Activity and Spiritual Warfare” for more information on how Satan and his demons work and how we must respond.

You may find more on Satan and the doctrine of angels here: http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=388

Carmela wrote:I'm glad you posted that, Frank. I think you posted it awhile back, didn't you? It's always worth a re-read because it's good to know how the enemy works and it's a good compliment article to what jeani posted.

Carmela it is a good article but I am not in agreement and let me share with you why.

Satan and God can not share the same space for God is Holy and Satan is not!

Satan is not in heaven as spoke of here. Sure he is the accuser of the brethren day and night but God is omnipresent and He can see all, hear all, know all! He is also not omnipresent and cannot be in more then one place at one time.

That is one of the reasons I posted this:

IV. The Fall of Satan

Key Passages – Ezekiel 28; Isaiah 14

A. Ezekiel 28:11-19 is a prophetic lamentation over the “King of Tyre” who is described in language that fits Satan’s fall and not a mere human king. Satan is distinguished form the human ruler of Tyre in 28:2 (“prince/ruler”) and called a “king” in 28:12 (Not even Israel’s rulers were called “King”). Though Tyre had a human “ruler”, Satan was the real “King” behind that wicked kingdom.

B. His attributes – Moral perfection (v.12) Sinless at his creation until his fall (v.15)

C. His appearance – Perfect in beauty (v.12b,13)

1. His privileges – Free access to the garden of Eden (v.12) and to God’s holy mountain (= God’s presence – v.14)

2. His rank – “Cherub” (vs.14,16)

3. His judgment –

a. Cast out of the mountain of God (v.16, cf. Rev12:4)

b. Cast to the ground (v.17)

c. Consumed by fire (v.18, cf. Rev.20:10)

D. Isaiah 14:12-15 also seems to describe Satan’s fall. Satan is manifest here by the king of Babylon. As in Ezekiel 28, Satan is pictured here as the real “king” behind the wicked human kingdom of Babylon.

1. The imagery of a “star” and “falling from heaven” (v.12) suggests a supernatural fulfillment. “Stars” (v.12,13) are symbolic of the angelic realm elsewhere (Job 38:6,7; Rev.12:4).

2. The five “I will’s” of vss. 13 & 14 are literally true of Satan and only metaphorically true of Babylon’s king. This ultimate form of pride (“I will be like the Most High” – v.14) fits the New Testament description of Satan’s fall 1 Tim.3:6.

I could be wrong and have been before but it is not anything to debate or get bent out of shape over.

The most important thing is knowing that he is defeated and his demise is already taken care of.

I was thinking that in the Bible it speaks of satan being before the throne of God when he is accusing the brethern. I think the cobwebs in my head are getting thicker and I need to go back to bed!!

Carmela wrote:I was thinking that in the Bible it speaks of satan being before the throne of God when he is accusing the brethern. I think the cobwebs in my head are getting thicker and I need to go back to bed!!

I beleive it does but we also can come before the throne of God but we are not in heaven! When the fall of Satan took place he was cast to earth with all of the other angels that followed him. Some were put under the earth, some on the earth and some in the seas and rivers, but they were all cast out of heaven at the same time.

I really don't know were Satan is at this moment, but I know were he is not and he is not in the Third heaven were God.

He roams to and fro seeking whom he may devour like a roaring lion!

Here is a good read:

Question: "How, why, and when did Satan fall from heaven?"

Answer: Satan’s fall from heaven is symbolically described in Isaiah 14:12-14 and Ezekiel 28:12-18. While these two passages are referring specifically to the kings of Babylon and Tyre, they also reference the spiritual power behind those kings, namely, Satan. These passages describe why Satan fell, but they do not specifically say when the fall occurred. What we do know is this: the angels were created before the earth (Job 38:4-7). Satan fell before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden (Genesis 3:1-14). Satan’s fall, therefore, must have occurred somewhere after the time the angels were created and before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden. Whether Satan’s fall occurred a few minutes, hours, or days before he tempted Adam and Eve in the Garden, Scripture does not specifically say.

The book of Job tells us that, for a time at least, Satan still had access to heaven and to the throne of God. “One day the angels came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan also came with them. The LORD said to Satan, ’Where have you come from?’ Satan answered the LORD, ‘From roaming through the earth and going back and forth in it’” (Job 1:6-7). Apparently at that time, Satan was still moving freely between heaven and earth, speaking to God directly and answering for his activities. At what point God discontinued this access is unknown.

Why did Satan fall from heaven? Satan fell because of pride. He desired to be God, not to be a servant of God. Notice the many “I will...” statements in Isaiah 14:12-15. Ezekiel 28:12-15 describes Satan as an exceedingly beautiful angel. Satan was likely the highest of all angels, the most beautiful of all of God's creations, but he was not content in his position. Instead, Satan desired to be God, to essentially “kick God off His throne” and take over the rule of the universe. Satan wanted to be God, and interestingly enough, that is what Satan tempted Adam and Eve with in the Garden of Eden (Genesis 3:1-5). How did Satan fall from heaven? Actually, a fall is not an accurate description. It would be far more accurate to say God cast Satan out of heaven (Isaiah 14:15; Ezekiel 28:16-17). Satan did not fall from heaven; rather, Satan was pushed out of heaven.

http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-fall.html

I did, Frank, with the help of my bible commentary.

I still believe scriptures teaches Satan goes to and from in the earth,and has access to God.

Job 1:6-7
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord,and Satan also came among them.

And the Lord said to Satan, 'From where do you come?' So Satan answered the Lord and said, 'From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking back and forth on it.

I believe Satan will be cast out of the Heavenlies described in Rev. 12:7-17 to enter the Antichrist.

Rev. 12:7~
And war broke out in heaven; Michael and his angels fought with the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought.

but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer.

So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

Then I hard a loud voice saying in heaven, 'Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night has been cast down.

Now I believe there is 'three heavens',and what heaven Satan was in doesn't say so,but I do believe he had to answer to God until he's kick out of heaven in Rev.

First heaven: atmosphere heaven for birds and clouds in Hos 2:18 Dan 7:13

Second heaven: stars~ Genesis 15:5; Gen 1:14-18

Third heaven: A place called glory in John 14:13 Rev. 12:5

Christ is caught up in throne room.

Paul caught up in third heaven in 2 Cor. 12:1-2

Heaven place of beauty in Rev. 21:1-22:7; of life in 1 Tim. 4:8; service in Rev. 22:3; worship in 19:1-3; and glory in 2 Cor 4: 17-18

Sorry, I guess we 'disagree~'

Sorry, I guess we 'disagree~'

Yes, on this we do! I never expected us to agree on everything but concider what each has to say on the matter. I will take it into careful consideration and thought and I hope you do the same!

Remember Satan is not omnipresent and he has been on the earth since the fall of Adam and eve. He also appeared on the Mountain with Jesus to tempt Him in the desert. These are some of the mysteries that one day will be revealed completely.

God Bless!

Not to further complicate matters but are you saying that satan's appearance on earth was simultaneous with the appearance of Adam and Eve - and not before?

he has been on the earth since the fall of Adam and eve

januarie wrote:Not to further complicate matters but are you saying that satan's appearance on earth was simultaneous with the appearance of Adam and Eve - and not before?

he has been on the earth since the fall of Adam and eve

No! I am just making the point that he is on the Earth and not in heaven now!

Why did Satan fall from heaven? Satan fell because of pride. He desired to be God, not to be a servant of God. Notice the many “I will...” statements in Isaiah 14:12-15. Ezekiel 28:12-15 describes Satan as an exceedingly beautiful angel. Satan was likely the highest of all angels, the most beautiful of all of God's creations, but he was not content in his position. Instead, Satan desired to be God, to essentially “kick God off His throne” and take over the rule of the universe. Satan wanted to be God, and interestingly enough, that is what Satan tempted Adam and Eve with in the Garden of Eden (Genesis 3:1-5). How did Satan fall from heaven? Actually, a fall is not an accurate description. It would be far more accurate to say God cast Satan out of heaven (Isaiah 14:15; Ezekiel 28:16-17). Satan did not fall from heaven; rather, Satan was pushed out of heaven.

Remnant wrote:
No! I am just making the point that he is on the Earth and not in heaven now!

Gotcha! Thanks. ;)